Marine Arena
http://marinearena.info/

Elites
http://marinearena.info/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=498
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Author:  MaxLaks (Maximus) [ 11 Oct 2018, 12:18 ]
Post subject:  Elites

I think it's a big problem that you can block the Elite shops. The guy who gets his first elite, especially a Banshee, he can just sit, have 100% tower control, and block the shop completely. The other players can't trade with you at all, which means they have to buy a hero to counter. The expensive heroes costs too much to get, because you can't trade, therefor you can't get minerals. If the guy, who got his elites, gets an early Ghost too, you can't even get cheap heroes to try and get out of the bad position. The Ghost player has tower control so he can just emp HTs, Infestors, DTs. If you are a good Phoenix player you can do something about it, but imo, that shouldn't be the only way to deal with it.

My suggestion is to make elites buy-able on the CC, like in US.

Author:  Kontz [ 11 Oct 2018, 13:09 ]
Post subject:  Re: Elites

God no

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=umDr0mPuyQc

Author:  Kontz [ 11 Oct 2018, 13:11 ]
Post subject:  Re: Elites

And nooow for real response Blocking a team from the shop is part of the game. Aswell as dealing with people blocking the shop. And the early fight for the shopppp

Author:  MaxLaks (Maximus) [ 11 Oct 2018, 13:18 ]
Post subject:  Re: Elites

Kontz wrote: And nooow for real response Blocking a team from the shop is part of the game. Aswell as dealing with people blocking the shop. And the early fight for the shopppp
Yes.. It's a part of the game. That doesn't make it fun and interactive. Can you tell me in what ways this is interresting?

Author:  Crow [ 11 Oct 2018, 15:11 ]
Post subject:  Re: Elites

tl,dr.
The whole point of the elite shop being in the center is to be able to make having control of it a strategic advantage meaning you can include the shop control into your tactics, for example when someone camps in base you deprive them off the shop so they cant buy tanks and sentries
PS
in your example the person who got the shop early clearly has a lot of money which means you must have fed him if he can afford 3 banshees and a ghost before you can even afford a ghost. i would say in that case you are rightfully doomed :p

also he cannot have control of the tower all early game; by being out on the map instead of you who cant engage he will eventually have a significantly lower mass than you means you can force your way onto the shop or he is forced to retreat for a plethora of other reasons.

If you look at underthings for example he gets ms and blocks the shop but it leaves those expensive elites open for snipes if he doesnt dynamically move around tthe map

Author:  MaxLaks (Maximus) [ 11 Oct 2018, 16:08 ]
Post subject:  Re: Elites

Crow wrote: you must have fed him if he can afford 3 banshees and a ghost
Yes then you have been feeding real good. What I'm saying, is that if he just gets one Banshee he can control the tower and the shop. Then eventually he can buy more Banshees and then you are locked into your base.

Crow wrote: If you look at underthings for example he gets ms and blocks the shop but it leaves those expensive elites open for snipes
Banshees doesn't get sniped easily, they are very agile, and can kill a Ghost before it even gets the snipe done.

Author:  Kontz [ 11 Oct 2018, 16:55 ]
Post subject:  Re: Elites

could also add the marine range and speed . AND rebuy savs to cc just remove all shops ... Buff cannons and never leave our base

Author:  Eyyo [ 11 Oct 2018, 17:04 ]
Post subject:  Re: Elites

I agree with max on ellite shop. It punishes tower trading early (gets you less mass for the shop battle) even if you played your cliff fight well. Then after they get their banshees u can only really get nix as have been stated. Ghosts arent going to kill banshees consistantly against good players. Ellite shop blocking often have to do a lot with how much pressure the other teams put on the camping one which is out of your control.

Besides shop control feels a bit inconsistent so even if you would rush the shop at 4 min with other teams doing the same, it feels like you just sometimes can get the control to buy ellites while the enemy is nearby and sometimes you cant. This makes it just feel completely random who gets their ellites first and thus get to camp and then gets a big lead.

Author:  MaxLaks (Maximus) [ 11 Oct 2018, 17:43 ]
Post subject:  Re: Elites

Eyyo wrote: Besides shop control feels a bit inconsistent so even if you would rush the shop at 4 min with other teams doing the same, it feels like you just sometimes can get the control to buy ellites while the enemy is nearby and sometimes you cant.
Good point too. I completely agree.

Author:  MaxLaks (Maximus) [ 11 Oct 2018, 17:46 ]
Post subject:  Re: Elites

Kontz wrote: could also add the marine range and speed . AND rebuy savs to cc just remove all shops ... Buff cannons and never leave our base
If you could back this up with any arguments it would be appreciated. I don't think it would be a good idea though, because if there are no shops in the middle, the game will lose some flavor.

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